Chelts extra place offers

I haven’t seen much mention of this on here, so I thought I’d point out how lucrative they can be.
Basically, if you back and lay E/W and your horse comes in the extra place position you win your bet and your lay. Its well worth doing if you are backing multiple horses in the same race, as the “win” portion of the bet still qualifies for whatever the offer is (MBS 2nd, 4/1 winner etc)
Method – divide your horses odds by the factor of payout and lay accordingly
eg, The fictional horse Gubstar is 5/1 and the E/W payout is 1/4
convert your odds to decimal, so 5/1 = 6.0
divide odds by taking 1 off, divide by 4 and add 1 again =
so 6 – 1 = 5
5/4 = 1.25
1.25 + 1 = 2.25

so you would back Gubstar £25@5/1 and check the E/W box (backing each way in effect makes two bets, one for the win and one to place, so a bet of £25 is actually a bet of £50)

lay Gubstar as usual on the exchange win market using £25 as your back bet, then scroll down s market to the lay market and use the figure of 2.25 back odds for the £25 E/W part of the bet.

Gubstar wins = wins 4/1 winner offer/ 3/1 winner offer – back win wins, back place loses, lay win loses, lay place wins
Gubstar 2nd = 2nd place offer – back win loses, back place wins, lay win loses, lay place wins
Gubstar finishes in 5 place = £££££ back win loses, BACK PLACE WINS, lay win loses, LAY PLACE WINS

Gubstar last – Gubdonkey!

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deathstar
25

March 11, 2016 at 10:59 am

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AM 0 March 18, 2016 at 12:10 pm

Yeah I’m struggling to get my head round this one as well. Using the b365 place top 3 and Smarkets place top 3 I get it as the following.
1) If the horse wins, you win the bookie bet and the bookie e/w and have lost the lay and lay e/w.
2) If the horse places, you lose the bookie win, win the lay, win the e/w bookie and lose the e/w lay.
3) If the horse doesn’t place then you win both lay bets and lose both bookie bets

So based on the above with a £25 e/w bet and using Cue Card 5/5.2 win and 2.25/1.74 e/w at B365 with lay stakes of £24.13 for win and £32.7 e/w I get that you win ~ £5.70 regardless of what happens. Is that right?

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FoG_BLoG 47 March 18, 2016 at 12:25 pm

AM bet365 EW terms for that race are 1/4 for 1-2-3.

So you are getting 2.0 for a place not 2.25.

They are not paying out an extra place, so its not the same thing.

It looks like you found some kind of an arb on the ew place price. But you have to take a small hit on the to win market. Still a small profit either way as you say and also a chance at getting a risk free bet if he wins.

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FoG_BLoG 47 March 18, 2016 at 12:41 pm

Im not sure if e/w bets count towards the 4/1+ offer, but if it did then you could go e/w on this horse to reduce qualifying losses. Not sure if its quite a profit when you calculate using 2.0 instead of 2.25 …

Don Poli and Djakadam also fall into similar scenarios.

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AM 0 March 18, 2016 at 12:43 pm

I knew I’d made a mistake somewhere, forgot to minus the 1 before dividing the win odds but now I’ve got the spreadsheet working properly (thanks FoG) if you can find the right horses then some of these other offers are pretty good. As it happens cue cards place lay odds drifted to 1.88 so it meant an overall qualifying loss of a penny to get the risk free bet.
I guess you could take this further to incorporate the risk free bet component which would guarantee profit if the horse didn’t win but give you a small loss if it does. Couldn’t see anything which says e/w is excluded in the terms unless that’s what single bet implies.
With the scenario above if they’re paying on the extra place then there’s the potential for some decent profits to be made providing you can find the right back/lay odds for all cases.

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deathstar 25 March 18, 2016 at 6:34 pm

Sorry for the late reply, I haven’t been about today.
@Fog that’s correct in terms of the maths and theory, although the match itself is pretty poor. Its the sort of thing I would take if I was trying to cover the entire field though! (only once with 14 runners)
As mentioned above, there is opportunity for arbs on the each way place, so I find the best way to approach these is to only do it when you can find an excellent match, or in combination with MBS’s or 4/1’s etc. Most bookie T+C’s state only the win part of the bet is eligible for freebies, so this means the half thats the bet on the win, not the full stake. (so £25 E/W would be a £50 bet, but you’d get £25 MBS for coming 2nd)

Even when doing an offer without an extra place, I usually look at the E/W odds just in case there is an arb on the place.

Be very careful what the place terms are, in the 4.10 today, all the bookies were paying out at 1/4 EXCEPT paddy who had 1/5.
HTH

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FoG_BLoG 47 March 18, 2016 at 6:42 pm

Thanks Deathstar.

188bet were paying out 1/5 all day so their extra place offer was garbage.

I did the 2:10 and 4:10 on betfair so also had a chance of free bet if a win, so I accepted high enough qualifying losses.

In the 2:10 my guy was 4th, by a neck. I needed him 5th.

In the 4:10 my guy was 3rd by just a length. I needed him 4th.

So two close misses.

I think I still made money off them because of BOG.

Looks like these are well worth doing.

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deathstar 25 March 18, 2016 at 7:00 pm

Unlucky. I’ve had the same problem this year, but I managed to hit both yesterday. the odds were much better yesterday though by the looks of it. I was kicking myself when starchitect rolled in 5th earlier, but I just couldn’t justify the £7+ qualifying loss.
The beauty of these is you can do them even if you’re gubbed. so as long as the old stan james or 888 accounts still take your money, its worth having a look at the outsiders on them to increase your chances.

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