EW Arbing
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Merry Christmas all, day’s over now so back to the grind 🙂
Have started trying out ew arbs, finding them manually but have two questions.
1. To try and remain under the radar, do you avoid races with a decent arb on the win market?
As an example, would a 17/13 with place at say 5/3.8 be too obvious?
Is it better to do say a 17/17 with the place at 5/3.8?
Or is the ew bet alone enough to reduce back bet profits at the bookmaker?
2. What kind of stakes can we get away with doing ew arbs?
Made up with my match betting profits so far and i generally have 2-3 hours spare most days and ew arbing defo seems like a good profit booster to overall profits.
Any comments appreciated.
+0December 26, 2016 at 12:27 am
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Learning the fundamentals takes 10-15 minutes and you’ll make £15 in the process.
1. depends on how much you like the bookie.
2. depends on how much the bookie lets you get on, and what sort of float you have.To expand, I only use my gubbed accounts for E/W arbing unless its a really big race and my bets would fit into a mugging pattern. Arbing will kill your account, so it depends how much you value that account and there’s no point burning 365 say, when you have a gubbed coral account thats offering similar odds. And some bookies will limit the amount they stand to lose on your bet even if you are not gubbed, it depends on the race and the odds.
You always run the risk of a non-runner reducing the number of places as well. you can sort this out by using betfairs place markets, but you won’t be earning any money, probably lose some in fact, when this happens.
If you are thinking about going down the bet angel twitter type route be aware their approach is not entirely risk free as they bet early and lay late, which is fine, but you need to know a) sometimes odds lengthen, and b) what to do when rule 4 is applied.Having said all that, most of my profits come from E/W arbing, so it most certainly is profitable.
Good luck+0Cheers, so when you say how much you like the bookie, do you mean how long you want the account to last?
Im thinking if you only do races where the win side of the bet is break even, or even a slight loss, this will make accounts last longer as it would not be as obvious you are arbing.
I was hoping those more experienced could offer advice on this point.
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basically yes. there seems to be a consensus that beating SP along with how much you win at a bookie adds to the decision to gub, so by the very nature of horse betting you will be doing both those things whether you want to or not. but then again, nobody actually knows what leads to a bookie gubbing/limiting you, so to my mind its better to “waste” the accounts that rarely have offers on arbing and keep the good bookies for their offers.
+0Cheers deathstar, the main problem with ew arbing is that it is basically impossible not to beat the sp.
Even when taking a small loss on the win side, the price almost always comes in, i saw a 33/1 come into 8/1 today and win!!
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Johnbo… you are right in tbat 90% of ew arbs usually beat the sp… however if at the time the bet is placed the arb is not on the win it will not flag us as bad as a win arb!!!
16 runner hcaps are the best type of races to do these in because the win book has a massive overround in the bookies favour so will stand big bets all day on this market!!Did you get on the pleasuredome one i give early this morning on the other thread… became a massive arb on win and place!!
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johnbo,, as supert says the key is to not lay straight away and watch the price come down. its not for the faint-hearted. and certainly not for newbies really as some horses do go higher. Best thing to do is watch a market for a day and see how the odds move to get a feel for it. Also look at backing a horse that most bookies have the same price for, at least that way it appears you have taken a normal punt.
@ supert I did get on pleasuredome laid at 10.5/2.7 wish I hadn’t underlaid lol
got Baie Des Iles to make up for it though.+0
Good effort deathstar… yeah i fully underlaid pleasuredome just took enough extra to cover commission… got £85 ew in total…. little tip too… if 3 or 4 bookies are same price get 4 x £20 ew rather than £80 ew at 1 bookie!!
I had 50 ew night of sin too 22/1 that was smashed in too… to 12.0 on win but had laid win 21.0 lol … thought 1 would place so again just took my £50 back on the place and went for the big win!!
Baie des iles was a cracker great effort
Oh well #twga
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Baie des Iles was a cracker.
Cheers ???
#twga+0Ok guys thanks for the advice, i think i need to tone down the volume of bets i place where there is an arb on the win too, really want to keep at this, the profit is incredible.
@supert, i did get on pleasuredome yes, thanks for that one 🙂
@supert, so do you outright avoid ew arbs if the win part is an arb, so would 17/15 be avoided?
@deathstar, ive noticed whilst the win market almost always comes in, the place market can be quite stubborn! Laying the place straight away then laying the win later seems the way to go, provided there is a good 20-30 mins before the start of the race that is.+0
i think you are over worrying about this, bookies WILL gub you, there’s no getting away from it, the question is when. you have to decide whether you want to hit them hard and fast or plod along doing the odd offer here and there. That’s why I only use my gubbed accounts for arbing, they are no use for anything else once the free bets are taken away.
BTW, I wouldn’t lay the place and not the win early on, the problem doing it that way round is if you get a non-runner it will skew the win market AND you will have to apply calculations for the rule 4 deductions, and also you run the risk of the bookie paying less places while you have laid what it was before the non-runner.
If you are having trouble finding good odds matches, you aren’t looking hard enough! lol or possibly because there aren’t any decent races on when you look. This can’t be done on every single race, there are quite specific criteria for the E/W system to work.+0Some very informed posts on here. This is more one for deathstar and supert but on 365 they will always let you cash out 90 percent of your stake. So if say supert finds a horse early in the morning at 16/1 and lumps 100 ew like yday. He can cash out for 180 at any point if non runners or the horse majorly drifts. If his judgement is good and the odds come in then he can make money on both the win and the place as a calculated trade.
I though always laid the win straight away and left the place right up until a few mins before the race. Choosing not to lay the win is dangerous as your stuffed if the horse drifts. If your horse does drift and you haven’t laid the place the market will move at a slower rate as your betting on 1/4 or 1/5 of the odds and the fact it’s a good ew arb race means the odds are more robust.
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good to know beesty thanks, I tend to see cashing out as a personal failure so rarely do it! lol
I’ve been laying the win part at the same time and the place late, in the right race i’ve found that even if the odds lengthen, because its a “bad race” in the first place the odds only get to where they should be instead of an arb so I don’t actually find I’ve been losing too much from odds drifting. maybe just lucky!
On smarkets, I’ve noticed over the last couple of days that the best time to get on the place lay is actually around 10 minutes before the off, then the odds seem to start going up again. not sure why that would be.
@johnbo, a quick point, supert has a slightly different way of doing things, in that he finds horses that are badly priced and bets on them before the price starts to stabilise across all the bookmakers. That takes a lot of skill and knowledge of horses, form, the going etc and something that I can’t do because I know nothing about the gee-gees!+0Lads can anyone please take the time to try and explain EW Arbing right here with simple words please lol! I know you will guide me to some article now but that’s what I’ve been doing so far reading and not understading the terms – please someone help me with some examples so I can learn how to EW arb and another question why are people going on about how they use their gubbed accounts for EW – when you get gubbed, don’t you get restricted to like 0,40p stakes how can you possibly make profit when your max bet is that ”large”?
+0@deathstar and @beesty, thanks for the advice, really appreciate your effort in your replies to my questions…top forum this
+0@kieron you can read alll the guides to this in he world but this is really for experienced matched betting. The best way is to follow someone when they post a race or a horse and put 2.50 ew on it. Then focus on laying the win and the place. If done correctly you may win 30-50p but this will then build your confidence up to go bigger. The worst case scenario is you lose a fiver at the bookies unless u make a terrible mistake with the laying.
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